[Discussion] TRR Non-Aggression Pact

[Severisen Montresor]

Deshret,

I present to you today a Non-Aggression pact between Osiris and TRR. This has been an on-going discussion between Unibot, Delegate of TRR, Guy, MOFA for TRR, Cormac, Scribe of Foreign Affairs of Osiris, and myself. The hedjet has given me their opinions, and now we'd like to hear the opinions of the remainder of the Deshret. As usual, we will discuss for at least 4 days, at which point motions may be made to vote.

Non-Aggression Pact between Osiris and The Rejected Realms

Recognising that the past has been mired with diplomatic conflict and miscommunication between our regions,

Believing that any positive future relationship between our regions must first begin with mutual respect, recognition, and peace,

Both parties hereby:

1. Recognize the governments legally established under the Constitution of The Rejected Realms and the State Code of Osiris, and any legal successor governments thereto, as the legitimate governments of The Rejected Realms and Osiris, respectively.

2. Respect the right of these legitimate governments to govern their respective home regions.

3. Vow neither to invade the home region of the other party nor to participate in any action with the intent to overthrow their legitimate government as recognised in this Pact.

4. Understand that the parties are expected not to circumvent this agreement nor undermine its terms in any way, including through third parties.

Spoiler

Non-Aggression Pact between Osiris and The Rejected Realms

Recognising that the past has been mired with diplomatic conflict and miscommunication between our regions,

Believing that any positive future relationship between our regions must first begin with mutual respect, recognition, and peace,

Both parties hereby:

1. Recognize the governments legally established under the Constitution of The Rejected Realms and the State Code of Osiris, and any legal successor governments thereto, as the legitimate governments of The Rejected Realms and Osiris, respectively.

2. Respect the sovereignty of these legitimate governments over their respective regions.

3. Vow neither to invade the home region of the other party nor to participate in any action with the intent to overthrow their legitimate government as recognised in this Pact.

4. Understand that the parties are expected to abide by the terms of this agreement in good faith and not seek to undermine its terms through the use of third parties.

[Vaculatestar]

I like the treaty itself, but that fact that we are going into one with a defender region with Unibot at the head I just really don't like. I don't see myself voting aye for this one at all.

[Cormac]

I think the better way to look at it is that we are committing to non-aggression against a fellow Sinker, regardless of ideology. Not insignificantly, they are also committing to non-aggression against us, which was by no means guaranteed considering that some defenders didn't -- and presumably still don't -- view the Osiris Fraternal Order as the legitimate, native government of Osiris.

I would add that ratification of this pact will prove our detractors who claim that we are unreasonable and intolerant toward defenders, both internally and externally, wrong. We've proven them wrong before, but it's always nice to do it again.

Regarding Unibot, I think it's important here to point out that he is the one who extended this olive branch, first of all, and secondly that this non-aggression pact will no doubt extend beyond current Delegate terms in both regions. This decision should be about regions, not personalities.

[Venico]

I see no reason for this treaty. If TRR wants to attack us, we'll send them home. I also don't see a reason to recognize their government, nor do I care if they recognize ours. Doesn't matter if it's a sinker, a feeder, UCR, Warzone, whatever. Useless treaties are useless treaties.

[Andrew]

I agree with Cormac. I do believe that there will be some benefit for both sides of the pact (however small it may be).

[Venico]

I agree with Cormac. I do believe that there will be some benefit for both sides of the pact (however small it may be).

By that logic we should be signing treaties with every small UCR we can. There has to be a substantial benefit for us to sign a treaty. All we get out of this is recognition (which we don't need) and we won't be attacked by TRR (they won't since they're defender). What we give them is recognition of their government and any successor governments which we have no reason to give them. Oh and we can't "invade" them. I don't see this as a positive step, this is a step towards passing superfluous treaties and legislation.

[Andrew]

I agree with Cormac. I do believe that there will be some benefit for both sides of the pact (however small it may be).

By that logic we should be signing treaties with every small UCR we can. There has to be a substantial benefit for us to sign a treaty. All we get out of this is recognition (which we don't need) and we won't be attacked by TRR (they won't since they're defender). What we give them is recognition of their government and any successor governments which we have no reason to give them. Oh and we can't "invade" them. I don't see this as a positive step, this is a step towards passing superfluous treaties and legislation.

Thanks for speaking your mind. That has changed my entire viewpoint on this. Just shows how new i am to legislating

[Bob Moran]

Agreed, it is a useless treaty. They'll face us on the field, it's inevitable, so there's no working with them as long as they remain defenders, and osiris remains raider.

[Cormac]

We aren't working with them, we're agreeing not to attack them -- which we weren't going to do anyway. Nobody is ever going to give an order for the Sekhmet Legion to participate in an attack against The Rejected Realms or any other Sinker, and if anybody gives that order to the ISRA either they won't be in command of the ISRA anymore or we won't be in the ISRA anymore. That's the bottom line. Osiris does not attack other GCRs.

What we gain by putting what we already weren't going to do on paper is credibility and respectability that we currently don't have. Our treaties at the moment consist of treaties with UIAF member regions, Europeia, and Balder. Right now we look like a client state of the UIAF, and if the Deshret rejects this non-aggression pact we will look even more like a UIAF client state. Reality or not, we should not want that perception and we need to actually do something to correct it.

[Venico]

The benefit of this is minimal to non-existent and I see no reason to recognize their government nor do I think we should care about their recognition. Just because we are stuck with being a Sinker doesn't mean we have to be on good terms with every one of them. I think saying we don't need outside approval doesn't make us a subject to UCRs or any other org. I see no reason or substantial benefit from this treaty.