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[Proposal] Eight Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 11:12 am
by Jakuzure
Eight Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
Section 1: Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
(1) The following will be amended into the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order as Article II, Section 1(11):
Amendment Text wrote:(11) In the event that the Chief Scribe resigns or is removed from office an election shall be scheduled to happen as soon as possible. If more than one month remains in the current term then the newly elected Chief Scribe shall serve for the remainder of the current term. If less than one month remains in the current term then the newly elected Chief Scribe shall serve for a new full term.
(2) The following will be amended into the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order as Article II, Section 1(12):
Amendment Text wrote:(12) In the event that the Chief Vizier resigns or is removed from office an election shall be scheduled to happen as soon as possible. If more than one month remains in the current term then the newly elected Chief Vizier shall serve for the remainder of the current term. If less than two months remain in the current term then the newly elected Chief Vizier shall serve for a new full term.
[Proposal] Eight Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 11:20 am
by Sygian
I think we shouldn't allow them to be Chief Scribe longer than the term lasts, even if there is only less than one month that remains.
Perhaps when the Chief Scribe appoints his Deputy (or Deputies), he/she will choose one to be the "successor" so in the event of a resignation or removal, the chosen Successor will become the chief scribe. This would be if there is less than one month left, of course. Then elections would happen on schedule.
If there is more than one month of the term left, there could be a special election held for the remainder of the term, and the chosen Successor would be acting Chief Scribe until the special election concludes.
EDIT: You can replace Chief Scribe with Chief Vizier, I was just using Chief Scribe as an example.
[Proposal] Eight Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 11:30 am
by Jakuzure
I think we shouldn't allow them to be Chief Scribe longer than the term lasts, even if there is only less than one month that remains.
Either what I wrote wasn't clear - probably - or you didn't quite understand. No one would ever be serving longer than the regular three months, but they could be serving less - for example, if I became the Chief Scribe after someone resigned after the one month mark I wouldn't be the Chief Scribe for three months plus the time left in the previous term, I'd just be serving for three months. On the other hand, if the previous Chief Scribe resigned one month into their term I'd be serving for just two months.
Perhaps when the Chief Scribe appoints his Deputy (or Deputies), he/she will choose one to be the "successor" so in the event of a resignation or removal, the chosen Successor will become the chief scribe. This would be if there is less than one month left, of course. Then elections would happen on schedule.
I very much prefer having an election. If the Chief Scribe is elected under any other circumstances I don't really see the point in that happening, even if only when one month remains. Like I said, defaulting the term in that situation would be a better option the way I see it.
If there is more than one month of the term left, there could be a special election held for the remainder of the term, and the chosen Successor would be acting Chief Scribe until the special election concludes.
"Special" election or not, I think we're in agreement here.
I'll edit the amendment with more clear language in just a minute.
[Proposal] Eight Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 12:53 pm
by Jakuzure
Edited to reflect discussion with Sygian and Syberis in the Discord chat.
[Proposal] Eight Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 4:46 pm
by Jakuzure
Unlike what Cormac said a few days ago in the discord, I do believe there are terms. Whatever you want to call them, the fact is the Chief Vizer and Chief Scribe currently serve for a three months term, and as such I think this amendment makes perfect sense.
If no one else has anything else to add I'd like to motion to vote.
[Proposal] Eight Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 5:23 pm
by Sygian
I guess he had a point because they do have to resign.
[Proposal] Eight Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 6:12 pm
by Dalimbar
Given that the word "term" has been already used in Osiran legalese, such as in the following case:
Legal Code, Article II Section 1 wrote:(4) An electoral period will begin twelve days before the expiration of an elected official's term or as soon as practical after an elected office is vacated.
I'm unsure as to why there is a semantics issue.
I'm at present in favour of this idea in principle, but am unsure if we need two new clauses added into the Legal Code, or if it could be condensed. For example, following the spirit of Article II, Section 1, Subsection 4 and elsewhere, it could be argued that only one clause mentioning an "elected official" could suffice in this case.
[Proposal] Eight Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 7:06 pm
by Jakuzure
The initial draft actually had just one clause and mentioned "elected official" but due to the differences between the Chief Scribe and Chief Vizier I made two clauses instead, after discussion with Sygian and Syberies in the discord chat. The clause relative to the Chief Scribe isn't exactly the same as the Chief Vizier one.
[Proposal] Eight Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 7:10 pm
by Dalimbar
Thanks for the clarification!
[Proposal] Eight Amendment to the Legal Code of the Osiris Fraternal Order
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 1:18 pm
by Cormac
To clarify what I said on Discord:
What I meant by Osiris not currently having terms is that we don't currently have fixed terms. The way our terms currently work, when a Chief Vizier or Chief Scribe resigns or is removed from office, a new election is immediately held and the newly elected Chief Vizier or Chief Scribe then serves a new term of three months. That's why legislating that a newly elected Chief Vizier or Chief Scribe will serve "for the remainder of the term" doesn't currently make any sense. There isn't a "remainder of the term" because a new election means a new term.
The reason this has been the case is to avoid the messy and complicated business of abbreviated terms. Why have someone serve an abbreviated two month "remainder of the term" when we could just have them serve a new three month term? I should note this has also been the case for longer than the Scroll of Ma'at has existed; this was carried over from the previous constitution and system of government, and is how Osiris has done things since December 2013. I can't say that I see a reason to change it.
If you are going to change it, it probably requires more extensive legislation than this, and you need to carefully examine both the Scroll of Ma'at and the Legal Code to find potential conflicts and contradictions.
Even in this legislation, the second proposed amendment says the Chief Vizier will serve for the remainder of the current term if more than one month remains, but serve for a full term if less than two months remain in the current term. So you have the Chief Vizier serving for only the remainder of the term if more than a month remains, but a full term if less than two months remain -- which contradicts itself. If a month and a half remains, you're simultaneously saying the Chief Vizier will serve for only the remainder of the term and for a new full term.