Osiris Fraternal Order

Based on several of their posts, I believe Vienna is a more experienced player from elsewhere in NationStates than we had previously realized. I would like to get to know a bit more about them before admitting them to the Deshret, as this is our principal decision making body in the Osiris Fraternal Order.

I move for a vote on Vienna's membership application to the Deshret.

Evidence:

https://osiris.valthost.com/viewtopic.p ... t=11573928
https://osiris.valthost.com/viewtopic.p ... t=11573928
https://osiris.valthost.com/viewtopic.p ... t=11573928
https://osiris.valthost.com/viewtopic.p ... t=11573287

Interesting. I don't really have anything to contribute to this idea, but I'm not opposed to it.

I should add that if Vienna isn't forthcoming with more information about who they are and what they have previously done in NationStates for the past six years, I would urge the Deshret to vote against membership. We can't have people joining the Deshret who are unwilling to tell us who they are, what they've previously done, and who thus won't give us some idea of why they're here and want to participate in our legislature.

To be blunt, I also don't appreciate Vienna's tone right out of the gate, attacking other citizens and calling their integrity into question. If that's going to be how they are going to handle themselves in the Deshret, I don't want them here. We don't need it.

I'm not sure about this Cormac. Vienna applied for Deshret membership on March 27th and was later admitted by the Keeper the same day. So hasn't he/she already been admitted since approval was given by the Keeper? I mean she already has Councilor masking.

Andrew wrote:Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:26 pmI'm not sure about the legality of this Cormac. Vienna applied for Deshret membership on March 27th and was later admitted by the Keeper the same day. So hasn't he/she already been admitted since approval was given by the Keeper? I mean she already has Councilor masking.

The Deshret reserves the right to do a full membership vote for up to a week after a member is approved by the Keeper, iirc.

Andrew wrote:Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:26 pmI'm not sure about the legality of this Cormac. Vienna applied for Deshret membership on March 27th and was later admitted by the Keeper the same day. So hasn't he/she already been admitted since approval was given by the Keeper? I mean she already has Councilor masking.

From Section 3.1(b) of the State Code:

(b) The Keeper will accept or reject applications for membership in the Deshret within seven days of their filing. Any Councilor may move for a full Deshret vote on any membership application accepted or rejected by the Keeper within seven days of acceptance or rejection of the application.

We're still within the seven day time frame. This clause was amended into the State Code as a check on the Keeper's acceptance or rejection of an application.

Cormac wrote:Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:31 pm

Andrew wrote:Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:26 pmI'm not sure about the legality of this Cormac. Vienna applied for Deshret membership on March 27th and was later admitted by the Keeper the same day. So hasn't he/she already been admitted since approval was given by the Keeper? I mean she already has Councilor masking.

From Section 3.1(b) of the State Code:

(b) The Keeper will accept or reject applications for membership in the Deshret within seven days of their filing. Any Councilor may move for a full Deshret vote on any membership application accepted or rejected by the Keeper within seven days of acceptance or rejection of the application.

We're still within the seven day time frame. This clause was amended into the State Code as a check on the Keeper's acceptance or rejection of an application.

Oh crap. Sorry. I forgot about that

Andrew wrote:Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:32 pmOh crap. Sorry. I forgot about that

It's fine, it happens.

Cormac wrote:Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:20 pmI should add that if Vienna isn't forthcoming with more information about who they are and what they have previously done in NationStates for the past six years, I would urge the Deshret to vote against membership.

I can understand the thinking behind this, but maybe just asking would be a lot better than this drastic step.

Cormac wrote:Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:20 pmWe can't have people joining the Deshret who are unwilling to tell us who they are, what they've previously done, and who thus won't give us some idea of why they're here and want to participate in our legislature.

Has she been asked for her previous nation yet?

She's a friend from NS and I invited her to Osiris some time ago, she only just got around to getting here.

Cormac wrote:Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:20 pmTo be blunt, I also don't appreciate Vienna's tone right out of the gate, attacking other citizens and calling their integrity into question. If that's going to be how they are going to handle themselves in the Deshret, I don't want them here. We don't need it.

I would like to point to the tone you used in the Conference room, and how quickly that devolved into not nice things. The tone of a person should not be extremely disrespectful, yes, but to add that as a reason for this is kind of hypocritical, not to mention the rhetoric Tim shot back and the tone that many used during the debate on removal of PNG and your pardon.

Granted, she did go a bit over the line at times, but Tim gave back just as good as he got, and I don't see why she would be reprimanded and he would not be, especially over membership in the Deshret.

The Almighty Jesus Whale wrote:Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:40 pmI can understand the thinking behind this, but maybe just asking would be a lot better than this drastic step.

And maybe showing a modicum of respect in her responses to anyone since arriving in the Deshret would have been better than the drastic step of attacking the incumbent Pharaoh's integrity and attacking other citizens the Deshret voted to pardon. She has demonstrated no respect for anyone since arrival; why should anyone demonstrate respect for her? My respect is earned, not freely given.

The Almighty Jesus Whale wrote:Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:40 pmHas she been asked for her previous nation yet?

She's a friend from NS and I invited her to Osiris some time ago, she only just got around to getting here.

She's being asked now, and will have time to answer before we vote. I don't just want to know her previous nation though -- I want to know in which regions she currently resides, and in which regions she has resided in the past.

Also, I have to ask since you know her: Is she always this rude and disrespectful, or is there something about Osiris that brings that out in her? Because if she's always like this I'm having trouble understanding why anyone would invite her anywhere.

The Almighty Jesus Whale wrote:Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:40 pmI would like to point to the tone you used in the Conference room, and how quickly that devolved into not nice things. The tone of a person should not be extremely disrespectful, yes, but to add that as a reason for this is kind of hypocritical, not to mention the rhetoric Tim shot back and the tone that many used during the debate on removal of PNG and your pardon.

Granted, she did go a bit over the line at times, but Tim gave back just as good as he got, and I don't see why she would be reprimanded and he would not be, especially over membership in the Deshret.

Because she's brand new. You don't come into a region attacking its elected leader and multiple citizens whom you don't even know yet, haven't even had a conversation with. That isn't the kind of participation we need in this community.