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[Draft] Osiran Honors Act
Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 8:59 pm
by Cormac
Osiran Honors Act
Section 1: Establishment and Definition of Regional Honors
1. The following regional honors are established:
(a) The Violet Jewel of Atum will be the region's highest honor and will be awarded to individuals who have made longtime, outstanding overall contributions to the region.
(b) The Crown of Osiris will be awarded to individuals who have made outstanding contributions in service in regional leadership offices, or their equivalent prior to establishment of the Osiris Fraternal Order.
(c) The Scepter of Isis will be awarded to individuals who have made outstanding contributions to regional integration and culture.
(d) The Eye of Horus will be awarded to individuals who have made outstanding contributions to regional foreign affairs and World Assembly affairs.
(e) The Sword of Sekhmet will be awarded to individuals who have made outstanding contributions to regional military affairs, security, and intelligence.
(f) The Scale of Ma'at will be awarded to individuals who have made outstanding contributions to regional justice and law.
2. The Pharaoh may establish and award additional pharaonic honors, but such honors will not be classified as regional honors and will not confer the status or privileges conferred by regional honors.
Section 2: Honored Citizenship
1. Regional honors will confer honored citizenship upon citizen awardees.
2. Honored citizens will be granted a standing invitation to speak in the Deshret without regard for ordinary membership requirements established by the Deshret. Honored citizens will not have a vote in the Deshret unless they meet ordinary membership requirements.
Section 3: Qualification for Regional Honors
1. Regional honors may be awarded to any individual by the Pharaoh, with the approval of the Deshret.
2. Regional honors awarded to any awardee who is not a citizen of the Osiris Fraternal Order at the time of the award will not confer honored citizenship unless and until the awardee is admitted to citizenship in the Osiris Fraternal Order.
3. Honored citizenship will be automatically suspended upon an awardee's loss of citizenship, but will be automatically reinstated should the awardee once again be admitted to citizenship.
4. Regional honors and the honored citizenship they confer will be automatically revoked immediately upon conviction of an awardee for high crimes or felony crimes, unless the sentence imposed by the Pschent provides for temporary suspension and reinstatement of regional honors and honored citizenship by the Deshret.
5. The Deshret may revoke regional honors. Honored citizenship will also be revoked if all regional honors awarded to an awardee are revoked.
6. Regional honors awarded by the Pharaoh under the Osiran Holidays and Honors Act will continue to be valid under this Act, and will confer honored citizenship, as defined by this Act, upon previous awardees.
Section 4: Repeal of Previous Legislation
1. The Osiran Holidays and Honors Act is hereby repealed in its entirety.
Okay, changes made to the Osiran Holidays and Honors Act by this legislation:
- The holidays are repealed. Osiris hasn't been celebrating most of them despite the legal mandate to do so, and I think it would be better to celebrate holidays on an unofficial basis without a legal mandate.
- The Sword of Sekhmet is added as a regional honor for military, security, and intelligence contributions, which were previously lumped in with justice and law under the Scale of Ma'at.
- Honored citizenship is beefed up to grant citizen awardees extraordinary voting membership in the Deshret, meaning they will not have to meet the Deshret's membership requirements in order to remain members. Honored citizenship would still be suspended with loss of citizenship, so honored citizens won't be able to remain Deshret members without citizenship.
- Accompanying the beefing up of these privileges is a beefing up of how regional honors are awarded: They may now be awarded by the Pharaoh only with the approval of the Deshret. This will make the honors truly regional and more meaningful than they previously were.
- The primary reason for this legislation: The requirement of the previous legislation that honors will be revoked from any awardee convicted of high crimes and felony crimes, and that they may never again be awarded to such a person, is relaxed a bit in this legislation, in favor of suspension of regional honors for anyone convicted and the possibility of reinstatement by the Deshret after a sentence is completed.
- A provision is included to grandfather in previous regional honors awarded by the Pharaoh. Basically, passing this legislation will constitute Deshret approval for those previous honors.
Thoughts? Suggestions?
Credit where it's due: This was prompted by Scribe Rogamark's thoughts and arguments as presented
here and
here, which regrettably should not be discussed here -- at least not in great specificity -- because the Pschent is still for some inexplicable reason only visible to citizens, but the Deshret is visible to anyone.
[Draft] Osiran Honors Act
Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 9:59 pm
by Rogamark
While I would have preferred to wait until after the Pschent's ruling, I agree with the proposal for the most part. What I'm not happy with is the complete removal of the revocation provisions. The current law might be overly harsh, but this proposal overdoes it into the opposite direction.
My proposal would be to keep the automatic revocation, but drop the eternal ban on being awarded new honors. That way, convicted people have a perspective at earning their awards back through participation, which is far more beneficial to Osiris than any suspension-then-reinstatement rules. Plus another clause that allows the Pschent to replace the default revocation with what essentially amounts to a suspension, akin to what Raven did in Cormac's case, if they feel a total revocation would be unjust or otherwise improper in an individual case. That way they could impose whatever conditions they want.
Depending on whether the Deshret will agree with the ruling of the Pschent, we might also throw in a clause to clarify if a pardon undoes an automatic revocation, or not, or only if the pardon expressly says so (my personal favorite).
PS on visibility: Court proceedings are an internal matter and should be invisible to non-citizens, imo. Whereas the public part of the Deshret's proceedings hopefully provide an incentive to non-citizens to apply for citizenship and participate.
Edit: Oh, I see how that makes some discussions a bit complicated
[Draft] Osiran Honors Act
Posted: Sun Feb 07, 2016 1:59 am
by Rach
There is a glaring flaw in this proposal. It should say "honour" and "honoured". Not honored. Not sure what that even is
[Draft] Osiran Honors Act
Posted: Sun Feb 07, 2016 4:19 am
by Ridersyl
(b) The Crown of Osiris will be awarded to individuals who have made outstanding contributions in service in regional leadership offices, or their equivalent prior to establishment of the Osiris Fraternal Order.
I don't really like the idea of giving a "Crown of Osiris" to anyone that doesn't qualify as a sitting or former Pharaoh of Osiris.
[Draft] Osiran Honors Act
Posted: Sun Feb 07, 2016 10:52 am
by Andrew
Rogamark wrote:Sun Feb 07, 2016 2:59 amWhile I would have preferred to wait until after the Pschent's ruling, I agree with the proposal for the most part. What I'm not happy with is the complete removal of the revocation provisions. The current law might be overly harsh, but this proposal overdoes it into the opposite direction.
My proposal would be to keep the automatic revocation, but drop the eternal ban on being awarded new honors. That way, convicted people have a perspective at earning their awards back through participation, which is far more beneficial to Osiris than any suspension-then-reinstatement rules. Plus another clause that allows the Pschent to replace the default revocation with what essentially amounts to a suspension, akin to what Raven did in Cormac's case, if they feel a total revocation would be unjust or otherwise improper in an individual case. That way they could impose whatever conditions they want.
Depending on whether the Deshret will agree with the ruling of the Pschent, we might also throw in a clause to clarify if a pardon undoes an automatic revocation, or not, or only if the pardon expressly says so (my personal favorite).
PS on visibility: Court proceedings are an internal matter and should be invisible to non-citizens, imo. Whereas the public part of the Deshret's proceedings hopefully provide an incentive to non-citizens to apply for citizenship and participate.
Edit: Oh, I see how that makes some discussions a bit complicated
Ridersyl wrote:Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:19 am(b) The Crown of Osiris will be awarded to individuals who have made outstanding contributions in service in regional leadership offices, or their equivalent prior to establishment of the Osiris Fraternal Order.
I don't really like the idea of giving a "Crown of Osiris" to anyone that doesn't qualify as a sitting or former Pharaoh of Osiris.
I was kinda thinking the same thing however I was thinking of including Vizers as well. But I do like the text as it is.
[Draft] Osiran Honors Act
Posted: Sun Feb 07, 2016 5:17 pm
by The Almighty Jesus Whale
I don't like section II.
It looks to me like encroachment upon the Deshret's sovereignty.
[Draft] Osiran Honors Act
Posted: Sun Feb 07, 2016 7:43 pm
by Cormac
Rogamark wrote:Sun Feb 07, 2016 2:59 amWhile I would have preferred to wait until after the Pschent's ruling, I agree with the proposal for the most part. What I'm not happy with is the complete removal of the revocation provisions. The current law might be overly harsh, but this proposal overdoes it into the opposite direction.
My proposal would be to keep the automatic revocation, but drop the eternal ban on being awarded new honors. That way, convicted people have a perspective at earning their awards back through participation, which is far more beneficial to Osiris than any suspension-then-reinstatement rules. Plus another clause that allows the Pschent to replace the default revocation with what essentially amounts to a suspension, akin to what Raven did in Cormac's case, if they feel a total revocation would be unjust or otherwise improper in an individual case. That way they could impose whatever conditions they want.
I think this unnecessarily complicates the process, and I think it is also still too harsh. The Deshret should have the ability to reinstate honors because it is entirely possible that whatever the person did to earn those honors outweighs whatever they did to get convicted of a high crime or felony crime.
Leaving this to Deshret approval allows the Deshret to decide whether it's in the interests of justice to continue revocation of honors or to reinstate them. If the Deshret feels reinstatement isn't appropriate, it won't happen. I think that's a far simpler process and is entirely appropriate.
Rogamark wrote:Sun Feb 07, 2016 2:59 amDepending on whether the Deshret will agree with the ruling of the Pschent, we might also throw in a clause to clarify if a pardon undoes an automatic revocation, or not, or only if the pardon expressly says so (my personal favorite).
Aye, I may further amend this draft depending on the Pschent's ruling.
Rogamark wrote:Sun Feb 07, 2016 2:59 amPS on visibility: Court proceedings are an internal matter and should be invisible to non-citizens, imo. Whereas the public part of the Deshret's proceedings hopefully provide an incentive to non-citizens to apply for citizenship and participate.
Edit: Oh, I see how that makes some discussions a bit complicated
Yes, exactly.
I don't know of many other Feeders or Sinkers that make their courts only visible to citizens.
Rach wrote:Sun Feb 07, 2016 6:59 amThere is a glaring flaw in this proposal. It should say "honour" and "honoured". Not honored. Not sure what that even is
MURICA.
Ridersyl wrote:Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:19 amI don't really like the idea of giving a "Crown of Osiris" to anyone that doesn't qualify as a sitting or former Pharaoh of Osiris.
The problem is this is an existing honor that has already been awarded, so if we amend or remove it now, we will be either significantly changing the meaning of an honor that some people already have, or will effectively be removing honors from some people to whom they've been awarded.
The Almighty Jesus Whale wrote:Sun Feb 07, 2016 10:17 pmI don't like section II.
It looks to me like encroachment upon the Deshret's sovereignty.
How can the Deshret encroach upon its own "sovereignty"?
[Draft] Osiran Honors Act
Posted: Sun Feb 07, 2016 8:48 pm
by Rogamark
Cormac wrote:I think this unnecessarily complicates the process, and I think it is also still too harsh. The Deshret should have the ability to reinstate honors because it is entirely possible that whatever the person did to earn those honors outweighs whatever they did to get convicted of a high crime or felony crime.
Leaving this to Deshret approval allows the Deshret to decide whether it's in the interests of justice to continue revocation of honors or to reinstate them. If the Deshret feels reinstatement isn't appropriate, it won't happen. I think that's a far simpler process and is entirely appropriate.
Criminal convictions - and in my mind, that includes its consequences - should not be voted on. Justice is not a popularity contest, and because whether or not a person's prior achievements outweigh their misconduct is highly subjective, it's inevitably a political matter. A politicized justice is ew.
My system, if we don't let the Pschent have discretion, is spectacularly easy and uncomplicated: You get convicted of a felony or high crime, your awards are gone. But you can always earn them back, and I see no reason not to consider past accomplishments when thinking about such new awards. Further, if we allow pardons to reinstate awards, since pardons need to be approved by the Deshret, there's the vote you want. It's only one of many aspects in such a vote, but I consider it sufficient.
Cormac wrote:How can the Deshret encroach upon its own "sovereignty"?
You may recall from discussions in the region that must not be named that I've frequently argued against the legislature legislating away their competences - something even expressly prohibited in a lot of RL jurisdictions. In this case, providing an avenue to voting rights without going through the regular membership process, even a very important competence of the Deshret is affected. Now, I don't feel very strongly about this here and it's not a dealbreaker for me, just saying that the sovereignty argument is viable here.
[Draft] Osiran Honors Act
Posted: Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:02 pm
by Koth
For what it's worth, I also disagree with the notion of having honored citizens have Deshret privilege. I believe we have a Deshret invite system that's in place to do that separately.
[Draft] Osiran Honors Act
Posted: Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:41 pm
by Cormac
Honored citizenship really doesn't mean anything if it doesn't convey some privileges. We should at least keep the standing invitation to speak but not vote in the Deshret that previously came with these honors, otherwise there isn't much point in having legislated regional honors at all -- we should just leave them to the Pharaoh and repeal the Act.