Osiris Fraternal Order

Will revise your suggestions into Section 3.1 shortly.

Regarding restrictions on the Pschent, I don't have any problem with lightening up on those restrictions a bit. Justices are allowed to serve in the Assemblies of The North Pacific and The South Pacific; it works fine there, there's no reason it should be a problem here. There is also no reason Elders can't serve in Priesthoods, the prerequisite to Deshret membership, since Priesthoods are just participation and don't come with any executive power.

I'm fine with just restricting Elders from serving as Pharaoh, Vizier, Hedjet, Atef, and Keeper. We don't want to exclude them from activity altogether; because if they have nothing to do here when there aren't judicial cases pending, which will be most of the time, they very well could lose interest and not be active and available when they're actually needed for judicial cases.

Cormac wrote:Sat Jan 04, 2014 5:11 pmI'm fine with just restricting Elders from serving as Pharaoh, Vizier, Hedjet, Atef, and Keeper.

I'm fine with that as well, as long as the language specifies that they may serve in the priesthoods and Deshret, I think we'll be alright.

Revised with all of Treize's most recent suggestions, including tentative revisions to Section 5.1 to allow Elders to be active in Priesthoods and in the Deshret -- pending further discussion of that issue.

Charles Cerebella wrote:Fri Jan 03, 2014 8:30 pmIn general I prefer r3n's system of non-mandatory ministries. I'll have a proper look through the new draft as soon as I can. I just went through a long law in Balder so might play Skyrim now

I generally prefer non-mandatory ministries as well, but given that we require active involvement in a Priesthood of the Hedjet for membership in the Deshret, I'm not sure how to make ministries non-mandatory without risking the possibility that there won't be enough opportunities for involvement to have a robust Deshret member base. I'm open to suggestions on this though.

On the subject of restricting other possible participation by the Pschent, I'm find with the Elders serving in the Priesthoods, but I'd prefer that they be prevented from serving as Pharaoh, Vizier, Hedjet, and the Deshret, precisely because I've envisioned them to check executive policies and legislation being passed by the Deshret.

EDIT: By the way, I'd just like to express my support to the amendments to the Pschent section as proposed by r3n.

I'd like to draw people's attention back to this draft. Once we get the procedure amendment passed, I think this is very close to(if not at the point of) submission.

The current language states that the Pshent can be Deshret and Priests. I'm inclined to support that langauge specifically because some of our finer legal minds will be on the Pshent, and I'd prefer strongly that those minds be available to assist in drafting of laws.

Some of my past experience in Old Osiris leads me to that view, but it's probably not worth the details. I'd like us to reach a consensus on that issue, as it's really the last sticking point of the State Code.

Most other game-created regions that have both judiciaries and assemblies don't restrict judges from their assemblies, for whatever that's worth. In The North Pacific and The South Pacific, for example, justices are allowed (required, I think, actually) to be members of the Assembly.

If we were pursuing an elected legislature (which we should not! ), I would agree that Elders should be restricted from serving in it. But with an assembly I think it should be all hands on deck. We could do what we've done with the Pharaoh and the Vizier and make them non-voting, ex officio members though if people are very concerned about conflicts of interest. It's less of a conflict if they're only advising but not voting.

I am fine with the current language in the draft.

Due to some conversations we've had about the inherent problems due to having a Pharaoh already when this passes, we're going to include some language about allowing a challenge immediately upon passage of the code.

Here's the language for an addition to 3.1(as e):

(e) Upon passage of this code, the incumbent Pharaoh may be immediately subject to a challenge election.

Revised!

Bit of a momentous occasion, but I can't think of anything clever to say: I move this to vote. Second and third anybody?