Osiris Fraternal Order

Lands of the South wrote:Thu Jun 19, 2014 1:55 amThe judiciary discussion did not even factor into my decision... My resignation is in no way intended to criticize you, Cormac. It just doesn't work for me.

I acknowledge that you didn't intend to criticize me, and I appreciate your kind words toward me. I probably shouldn't have had such a harsh reaction.

It's fine if it isn't working out for you. What isn't fine, and somewhat classless, is to essentially call Osiris backward and say you won't be at all surprised if we're couped again based on some issues in the Deshret that I, at least, perceived as relatively minor.

Nonetheless, best of luck to you elsewhere I guess, and I apologize for my strong words, though I don't appreciate you bashing my home region that I've poured a year and a half of near constant time and effort into, as have many others for varying lengths of time even if you are being nice to me personally in the process. No matter how nice someone is to me, personally, Osiris is my home and if you knock my home in an unjustified way you're insulting me as well.

Cormac wrote:Thu Jun 19, 2014 2:00 amI don't appreciate you bashing my home region

Silly Cormac, don't you know Game-Created Regions have no natives and are only made to be influenced by outside groups.

Cormac wrote:Thu Jun 19, 2014 2:00 am

Lands of the South wrote:Thu Jun 19, 2014 1:55 am It's fine if it isn't working out for you. What isn't fine, and somewhat classless, is to essentially call Osiris backward and say you won't be at all surprised if we're couped again based on some issues in the Deshret that I, at least, perceived as relatively minor.

Nonetheless, best of luck to you elsewhere I guess, and I apologize for my strong words, though I don't appreciate you bashing my home region that I've poured a year and a half of near constant time and effort into, as have many others for varying lengths of time even if you are being nice to me personally in the process. No matter how nice someone is to me, personally, Osiris is my home and if you knock my home in an unjustified way you're insulting me as well.

Ok, this statement of mine was probably uncalled for, and I apologize for unintentionally offending you. I will occasionally hang around, but right now, I do not want to be a member of the Deshret or in any way be affected by its decisions, so I had no other option than to renounce my citizenship as well. You know I have a bad temper. It's just that... jump over to Equilism and compare the tone of any randomly selected Senate discussion with one in the Deshret. You'll notify a considerable difference.

I have been around NS for a long time, and I've been a member of a number of regions. Some members of the Deshret display the same arrogance I remember from some discussions in the KRO. And, back in the days, from the Empire of Rage in the last months of its existence. I don't like it, and I don't like the PNG and application decision discussions and votes. I also disagree with the outcomes. And, especially, (without going into detail, because I will resolve the issue by other means) I don't like being insulted in another region for vocally opposing one of the PNG declarations. For the sake of completeness, the course of action taken in the Lazarus matter is also not what I would have done.

Silly Cormac, don't you know Game-Created Regions have no natives and are only made to be influenced by outside groups.

Speaking of statements that are uncalled for... Cormac's commitment to Osiris is beyond reproach, from what I've seen so far. I wouldn't advise you to make fun of it.

I am certainly sad to see you go. I must admit I have not been reading up on the Deshret lately, so I'm not sure what drama may have caused you to retire from this region, and I'm not sure I do want to know.

"...but I'm curious after all, so I ask you nevertheless" I'll tell you what: I'm sure that 90% of the rumors are exactly that, but I'm also sure you are not exactly as pure as driven snow. Yes, I opposed your PNG declaration, because I ultimately concluded you are not a harm to a region you are a member of. But your attitude in your application post didn't play well with me. I would welcome you in any region I am a member of, but I would keep an eye on you. Just to be safe.

Nonetheless, best of luck with your NS Career

Thank you. I've founded my first NS state... umm... three days before you turned 11, so I think I know what I'm doing by now... NS career-wise

Speaking of statements that are uncalled for... Cormac's commitment to Osiris is beyond reproach, from what I've seen so far. I wouldn't advise you to make fun of it.

I assure you, I wasn't being serious. Cormac's commitment to Osiris is unquestioned and I applaud how much he has done for this region, as well as how much patience he has for many of the antics that go on here. The post was intended as parody of a few players who I've seen post in Gameplay with statements along the lines of "GCR's have no natives". I personally hold no such opinion, and think a Game-Created Region can be just as much a home to someone as a User-Created Region.

"...but I'm curious after all, so I ask you nevertheless" I'll tell you what: I'm sure that 90% of the rumors are exactly that, but I'm also sure you are not exactly as pure as driven snow. Yes, I opposed your PNG declaration, because I ultimately concluded you are not a harm to a region you are a member of. But your attitude in your application post didn't play well with me. I would welcome you in any region I am a member of, but I would keep an eye on you. Just to be safe.

I phrased that a tad awkwardly. I actually really don't want to know too much what drama happened to cause this. I've got an idea, and I'll poke around once my curiosity overcomes my self-created apathy. Even though I'm PNG'd, I still care about Osiris I spent way too many hours on this region to truly be apathetic about it. My attitude was a fairly jokish one, since I didn't really expect to be admitted and I've found that I'm much less stressed by Nationstates if I take it much less seriously. I was surprised I wasn't banned on the spot, honestly. Apparently I overestimated what has essentially become the NS version of McCarthyism - accusing people of being Empire members. Keeping an eye on me, eh? It must be my subversive Defender charm. You just can't look away.

Thank you. I've founded my first NS state... umm... three days before you turned 11, so I think I know what I'm doing by now... NS career-wise

Hah, well there you go! I'm still allowed to wish you continued luck and success in NS, though, am I not?

Hmm... How unexpected

Apparently I overestimated what has essentially become the NS version of McCarthyism - accusing people of being Empire members.

Actually, some posts in the discussion triggered some old memories of school. "Thus now I shall indeed speak with you in such a way so it is apparent that I am not moved by the hatred which you do deserve, but by the pity which you do not deserve." In Catilinam, if I remember correctly. Not my style.

Keeping an eye on me, eh? It must be my subversive Defender charm. You just can't look away.

The day I make political decisions out of sympathy alone is the day I quit NS. As much as I'd like to further respond to that publicly (and enjoy the ensuing discussion), you really, really don't want me to

Hah, well there you go! I'm still allowed to wish you continued luck and success in NS, though, am I not?

Certainly, young padawan *limps off with a crutch, mumbling about the good old times when there were no things like mass recruiting telegrams and Nazi regions in NS*

Rogamark -

Your lengthy "NS Career" has been little more than piddling around in UCRs nobody's heard of and occasional shitstirring in Equilism and in Osiris. Don't make anything more of it than it actually is. You don't have any grounds to call Tim Stark "young padawan" - he's contributed more to the game than you have up to now or ever will.

You've said your piece - you don't like Osiris and that's fine. Piss off.

Blaine Zeorus Montresor wrote:Thu Jun 19, 2014 3:30 amRogamark -

Your lengthy "NS Career" has been little more than piddling around in UCRs nobody's heard of and occasional shitstirring in Equilism and in Osiris. Don't make anything more of it than it actually is. You don't have any grounds to call Tim Stark "young padawan" - he's contributed more to the game than you have up to now or ever will.

You've said your piece - you don't like Osiris and that's fine. Piss off.

Aside of the fact that you are a) grossly distorting what I actually said and b) missed the jokish tone of the discussion...

seriously?

Ah, I didn't realize the PNG discussions lately were the root of the issue.

The persona non grata declarations are meant to be a security safeguard, to prevent Osiris from being overrun by those who are legitimately hostile to our interests. It's not, or at least shouldn't be, that we don't want anyone who disagrees with us. It's that we don't want anyone here who so strongly disagrees with us and the course we've chosen for our region that they'll do everything they can to make sure we can't pursue that course. These kind of safeguards are literally essential in Feeders and Sinkers if they're to get anything beyond non-controversial cultural matters accomplished. The founderless nature of our regions, their size, their importance in Gameplay, all make them attractive to people who would not have our interests at heart.

That said, I think PNG has thus far been used too liberally by both the previous Pharaoh as well as by the Deshret. I disagreed with Tim's PNG and I continue to disagree with it. The Deshret should overturn it. It should be a security safeguard to keep out true threats, not a means to keep out people with whom we are uncomfortable, don't like, or we're afraid might offer an opinion that differs from our own. I'm seeing PNGs used increasingly for that reason and it shouldn't be happening. I agree with you there.

I have no idea what may be going on in other regions, so I'm not going to comment much on that except to say that Osiran matters really should not be carried elsewhere nor should other regions' matters be brought here. If that's been happening, I'm sorry and I hope it will stop.

Thank you for clarifying what issues you've been having, as I wasn't aware this was actually the issue. Or that it was continuing to be an issue anywhere. I hope at some point you'll return to citizenship and I'm sorry you haven't enjoyed your experience here.