Osiris Fraternal Order

I see that my previous comments are being interpreted as a threat, so please allow me to clarify. I'm not saying that I won't nominate anyone else for Vizier, or trying to strongarm the Deshret.

What I'm saying, I thought clearly, is that I don't know who else to nominate for Vizier. My view is that Treize is active, experienced, and has already been entrusted by the Deshret with the responsibility of being Guardian of the Atef. Meanwhile, most of our other active citizens are WA immobile either with our own military or with others. It was a challenge to get people to sit in Osiris for a few days and endorse the Pharaoh and the Vizier during the upcoming transition, and indeed Venico has now resigned from ISRA and taken his WA nation out of Osiris to pursue raiding with Sicarius. He's by no means alone. Most of our active citizens don't want to be WA immobile. Treize is an exception to that.

I did in fact say that if the Deshret rejects Treize and can suggest someone who is trustworthy, experienced, and active, I will nominate that individual for Vizier. I will not however nominate someone new to the region or so inactive in the region that we have no idea what they will do with the position, or what they would do with the position of Pharaoh which they would be in a strong position to pursue a term or two down the road as the incumbent Vizier. What some fear will happen if Treize is confirmed as Vizier could just as easily, if not more easily, happen if I nominate someone who is essentially a blank slate as a placeholder to sit in the position of Vizier and do nothing.

So, again, if the Deshret wants to reject Treize, it has that right and I look forward to your recommendations for trustworthy, experienced, and active Osirans to serve as Vizier.

I will not be offering any list of alternatives as I stand behind the nominations I have made. It's for those who oppose those nominations to suggest alternatives, which I will consider if any of my nominees are rejected.

Cormac wrote:Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:39 amIt's for those who oppose those nominations to suggest alternatives, which I will consider if any of my nominees are rejected.

With all due respect, and I really mean that, no it's not. It's your responsibility to put forth a nominee that acquires the approval of the Deshret and I'm not saying Treize won't. He very well could.

It's my responsibility to put forward a nomination, yes. It isn't my responsibility to ensure that there is a qualified nominee. That's out of my hands.

It isn't my fault that people are too invested elsewhere to either be active here or be WA immobile here. That's on them. One of the very people complaining about this nomination, a co-founder of the OFO, can't be bothered to give his WA nation in service to Osiris, as a region to which he didn't even belong one week ago now takes priority. That's what I have to work with. In the face of that, Treize is quite evidently the best person for the job as he is at least willing to actually do the job.

Venico BrightAxe wrote:Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:45 pmAnd if Zeorus is serious about being active again, I'd suggest him. And if he's not, then I would object to his nomination to the Atef.

As posted here, I am back. I plan to be back to stay. The possibility of me as Vizier did come up briefly in conversation between Cormac and I, however the position had already been offered to Treize so I decided to see what the Deshret had to say. If Osiris will have Treize as Vizier I'm content to return to the Seshat.

Should he fail to be confirmed, I would be happy to commit my WA as Vizier rather than Guardian.

Treize, I also don't trust you on the Atef. But that was beyond my control. While your ability to carry out the duties of a Vizier, I don't question, I simply can't put my trust in someone who has done to the community what you've done. And then TOLD us that given the opportunity you'd do it again to this government. I'm sorry, but I'm going to have to follow the advice you gave me and not let you near the delegacy.

Cormac wrote:Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:53 amIt isn't my fault that people are too invested elsewhere to either be active here or be WA immobile here. That's on them. One of the very people complaining about this nomination, a co-founder of the OFO, can't be bothered to give his WA nation in service to Osiris, as a region to which he didn't even belong one week ago now takes priority. That's what I have to work with. In the face of that, Treize is quite evidently the best person for the job as he is at least willing to actually do the job.

I just wanted to address this and say that I offered my WA. Any time that Osiris needs my WA, you just need to ask. You said you didn't need me and that I could go do what I pleased. If this changes, people just need to ask. This is still my home. I even offered my WA forward to help with the transition and even as Vizier, although I can't guarantee the activity you expect given the turbulent nature of my life at the moment. So please don't turn this into people not offering. People are offering and willing to commit. You're turning them away.

You offered your WA for the transition. You did not offer to be Vizier that I can recall, and while I do appreciate your offer now, you're right, I can't nominate you for Vizier when you declined Scribe of Culture because you didn't think you would be active enough.

Vizier isn't just a ceremonial role, which seems to be how people are treating it. You can't just plug anyone in there. The Vizier is the Vice Delegate, who is acting Pharaoh in the event of the Pharaoh's leave of absence and becomes Pharaoh until an election can be conducted in the event of the Pharaoh's resignation. Even if neither an absence nor a resignation occur at any point, as Vice Delegate of the region, Vizier is also an office that puts anyone occupying that office into a strong position for Pharaoh further down the road.

I can't just nominate Inactive Citizen X to serve as Vizier. It would be at least as irresponsible as some of you think it is for me to nominate Treize. This idea that people are offering and I'm turning them away just isn't accurate. I've only turned two three people away, and both all three have had significant inactivity issues.

Edit: Apparently Venico did offer to serve as Vizier on July 17, which completely slipped my mind. I apologize for the error.

Despite knowing them both well enough; I'm against Jack's appointment, and support James.

I feel ill-equipped as a knew member of the community to pass judgment on whether Treize should or should not be Vizier under this new administration. However, I am assured by how Treize served Osiris as Keeper extremely recently, and have confidence in Cormac's judgement. It's extremely difficult to analyse past events in relation with the present when you were not there during such turbulent periods, I can therefore only speak on a loose basis of opinion formed on what I have observed during recent times.

I am of course open to any questions Councilors may have!

Additionally, Vac:

I would ask the Keeper of the Deshret to please invite Jack Dawkins to speak before the Deshret in regard to his nomination as he is not currently a Councilor of the Deshret.

Post Script - I have no burdening issue with the Hedjet nominations, and am ultimately for the suggested appointments.

James wrote:Mon Jul 28, 2014 11:03 amI feel ill-equipped as a knew member of the community to pass judgment on whether Treize should or should not be Vizier under this new administration. However, I am assured by how Treize served Osiris as Keeper extremely recently, and have confidence in Cormac's judgement. It's extremely difficult to analyse past events in relation with the present when you were not there during such turbulent periods, I can therefore only speak on a loose basis of opinion formed on what I have observed during recent times.

The problem is him being Atef specifically and not necessarily in the executive.